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The Resurrection of the Dead, and Eternal Judgment
by John Bunyan
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1. They deny the man Christ to be without them, and own Christ no otherwise, but as he is within, contrary to that scripture, which saith, for "while we are at home in the body we are absent from the Lord." This is touching his bodily presence. And again, he was parted from them, "and a cloud received him out of their sight." And he was carried away from them, and so received up into heave (Acts 1:9-11). Now he that denieth this, is a deceiver, as is clear, in that he doth speak against the truth laid down in the scripture.

2. The Quakers are deceivers, in that they persuade souls that Christ is crucified in them, dead within them, and kept down with some thing within them, which was never taught by those that spoke the scripture from the Spirit of God. Shew me a scripture to confirm such a doctrine as this, which hath been avouched over and over by the Quakers.

3. The Quakers are deceivers, because they do persuade souls, that that man that was born of the Virgin Mary, is not above the clouds and the stare, when the scripture saith, "a cloud received him out of the sight of his saints." And again, that he is above the highest heavens, which must needs be above the stars, for they are not the highest.

4. The Quakers are deceivers, because they persuade souls not to believe, that that man that was crucified, and rose again flesh and bones (Luke 24:38-40). shall so come again, that very man, in the clouds of heaven to judgment as he went away; and at the very same time shall raise up all the men and women out of their graves, and cause them to come to the valley of Jehoshaphat; because there will he, that very man, sit to judge all the heathen round about. I say, they strive t beat souls off from believing this, though it be the truth of God witnessed by the scripture (Joel 3:11,12; Acts 1:10,11). "This same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come (mark, the very same) in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven." "And his feet shall stand in that day (the day of his second coming) upon the Mount of Olives" (Zech 14:4). Where is that? Not within thee, but that which is without Jerusalem, before, it on the east side. I say now, he that persuades souls not to believe this, but makes them believe there is no such thing, as the Quakers do, he is a deceiver. Again, the Quakers make no difference between that light wherewith Christ, as he is God, hath enlightened all; and the Spirit of Christ he gives not to all; and the Spirit of Christ he gives not to all, which I shall show by and by to be a deceit.

5. The Quakers are deceivers, because they say, That every one hath that which is like the Spirit of Christ, even as good as the Spirit of Christ, page 10 of his book, which is desperate blasphemy. The scripture saith plainly, "That some are sensual, having not the Spirit." And yet though they have not that, they have, says the Quakers, that which is as good as that. O wonderful deceit, as I shall farther show by and by when I come to the place. But to cover himself, and so his deceit, he doth apply that to himself that should be applied for the encouragement of the children of God: saying, the children of God was always counted deceivers, we (saith he) have a cloud of witnesses. Answer, friend, they were called deceivers, and were not so; but you are rightly called so, as I have already showed, and shall show farther by and by. In the meantime, know, that the devil knows how to take children's bread, and cost it to the dogs.

Then the next thing that he is grieved with, is, because I said, there are none but a company of light notionists, ranters, with here and there a legalist, that was shaking in their principles, that were carried away by the Quakers, &c. When this appears in all men's sight that can see, though you would not have it so (it is like.) And as for your saying, because all sorts of people are brought to God, I am offended therewith; I answer, No friend, I bless God my soul can rejoice that souls come in to Jesus Christ, though it grieves me to see, how some with a spirit of delusion are deceived, and destroyed, by its coming unto them as an angel of light. And whereas thou sayest I am like the Pharisees, who said, none believe, but a company of poor people, which know not the law. Answ. I bless God, I do know they are I bless God, I do know they are the poor that receive the gospel; but friend, I must tell you, that you and your fellows may seek for justification from the law, and yet have no better a recompense, than to be condemned by the law.

Now passing many railings, I come to the next thing that thou dost stumble at, which is in that I say, some of those delusions the devil doth deceive poor souls withal, is first, in that he doth persuade them, that salvation was not completely wrought out for sinners by the man Christ Jesus, though he did it gloriously upon the cross without the gates of Jerusalem. Now these words, "he did it gloriously on the cross, without the gates of Jerusalem," thou leavest out. Therefore I ask, do you believe that at that time, when he did hang upon that cross on Mount Calvary, that he did by that death he died there, redeem all his elect from eternal vengeance? If not, whatever thou sayest, thou wilt certainly see, that Satan hath caught thee in his snare, notwithstanding thy railing against the Lord Jesus. And friend, thou mayest call thy conscience the man Christ Jesus, or the light (as thou callest it) in thy conscience the man Christ Jesus; which if thou do, this is a delusion, and a dangerous doctrine. For a Spirit hath not flesh and bones, and so hath the man Christ Jesus. Now it may be, you think farther that the church, with the Spirit of Christ, is the man Christ Jesus, which is also a damnable heresy. Therefor, speak plainly; Dost thou believe that that man Christ Jesus is ascended from his people in his person? And again, dost thou believe that he which ascended from his disciples, did bring in everlasting salvation for them, in that his body which ascended from them? An answer to this might give great satisfaction to souls, if also it might be made in words easily to be understood. Again,

Thou art also offended with the second deceit which I lay down in my epistle, which is (say I) for the devil to bid souls follow that light which they brought into the world with them, telling them, that that will lead them to the kingdom. Now thou seemest gravelled, because I said, which they brought into the world with them. If thou art offended at that, show me when, and at what time every soul receives a light from Christ after it comes into the world. Now this I say, That every man hath not the Spirit of Christ within him (Jude 19). And that there is nothing that can show the soul the things of Christ savingly, but the Spirit of Christ (1Cor 2:11). Then will not you yourself confess, that he is deluded, that is persuaded to follow that light that cannot reveal Christ unto him? But I must mind you of one filthy error also which thou layest down in page 10. Corrupting the scripture to make it good, but in vain; where thou sayest, That light which every man is lightened withal, will lead unto the kingdom of peace and righteousness. And then thou addest, for saith Christ, "I am the light of the world, he that followeth me shall not [abide in darkness, or] walk in darkness." Pray mark, First, thou callest it the light of Christ, where with he hath lightened every one; and here thou comest a step higher, and callest it, Christ himself; and then corruptest that scripture, where the Son of Mary saith, "I am the light of the world," &c. Here thou wouldest very willingly have room to broach they folly, but it may not be; for though Christ be the light of the world, yet he is not in every one in the world. But secondly, I pray where was Christ when he spake those words? was he I say, within his disciples, or without them, when he said, "I am the light of the world?" He was without them, and walked up and down in the world with them from place to place, a very man. Therefore he did not mean at that time any light within, but himself who was without. And indeed, they who will follow Christ aright, must follow him without, to the cross without, for justification on Mount Calvary without, (that is, they must seek for justification by his obedience without.) To the grave without, and to his ascension and intercession in heaven without; and this must be done through the operation of his own Holy Spirit, that he hath promised shall show these things unto them, being given within them for that purpose (John 16:14). Now the Spirit of Christ that leads also, but whither? I leads to Christ without, which said, being without, "I am the light of the world: he that followeth me shall not walk in darkness, but shall have the light of life" (John 8:12). Deny this, that Christ was without when he spake those words (I am the light of the world) if you can.

But to come more close, to the thing. That light wherewith Christ, as he is God, hath lightened every one that cometh into the world, is the soul of man, which is the life of the body, and yet itself is but a creature, and made by the creator of all things (Isa 57:16). and is not the Spirit, as some do think it is. This creature hath one faculty of its own nature, called conscience, which hath its place in the soul, where it is as a judge to discern of things good or bad, and judge them accordingly, as the apostle saith, speaking of the heathens, "Their conscience also bearing witness and their thoughts the meanwhile accusing or else excusing one another" (Rom 2:14). This conscience is that in which is the law of nature (1Cor 11:14). which is able to teach the Gentiles, that sin against the law, is sin against God: And yet it is called but even nature itself, as he saith there, "Doth not even nature itself teach you?" &c.

Now this conscience, this nature itself, because it can control, and chide them for sin, who give ear unto it, therefore must it be idolized, and made a God of. O wonderful! that men should make a God and a Christ of their consciences, because they can convince of sin. But thou goest ramping on, and sayest, there is nothing but the light of Christ that will convince of sin, and thou biddest me, mind that. Now dost thou mean the Spirit of Christ? dost thou say that that which thou callest the light of Christ, is the Spirit of Christ? If so, then there is conscience which is not the Spirit of Christ, but a poor dunghill creature, in comparison of the Spirit of Christ; yet will convince of sin, as is clear, from that 8th of John. Where the woman is mentioned, who was taken in adultery by the Pharisees, or others, who when they heard brought her to Chris, and began to accuse her, Christ said, "He that is without sin among you let him first cast a stone at her." And what then? When they heard that, they were convicted by their own consciences. Mark, he doth not say, by the light of Christ in their consciences, as some would have it be; No, but by their own consciences they were convinced, and went out one by one. And were they all served so? Yea, from the eldest, even to the last; for they all had consciences, though not the Spirit of Christ. So that friend, here is something beside the Spirit of Christ, that can and doth convince of sin, even a man's own conscience, the law of nature; nay nature itself, which no man will say is as good as the Spirit of Christ, except they are guided by a deluding Spirit. Again, thou sayest, He that convinceth of sins against the law, leads up to the fulfilling of the law. Friend, thy conscience convinceth of sins against the law, follow thy conscience, it may lead thee under the curse of the law, through its weakness; but it can never deliver thee from the curse of the law by its power. For if righteousness come by the obedience to the law, or by thy conscience either, then Christ is dead in vain (Gal 2:21).

Again thou sayest, "That I and my generation would leap over the law."

Answ. For justification we look beyond it to the Son of Mary; yet we know that the law is good, if it be used lawfully; but if it be used unlawfully, as those do use it, who seek to be justified by their obedience to it, it is made and idol of, and a saviour, though it were given to no such purpose: For if there had been a law given which could have given life, verily righteousness should have come by (thy obedience to) the law (Gal 3:21). Now at thy conclusions, sometimes thou dost utter thyself in this wise, Learn what this means.

Answ. Indeed thy words are dark, and enough to deceive the hearts of the simple; but blessed be God, he hath given me to understand, that thou dost all along in the drift of thy discourse, disown Christ without, by pretending to a Christ within; whereas hadst thou indeed the Spirit of Christ within thee, it would be thy great business to extol and magnify the Son of Mary, the Christ of God without thee, because it is the nature of the same Spirit so to do, even to glorify Christ without, who went away from his disciples into heaven, to prepare a place for them (Luke 24:50,51).

Then thou further sayest (with a kind of disdaining spirit) "Many things more thou passest by in my book, as being not pertinent to the thing in hand." But I believe they are so pertinent, that neither thou, nor thy friends or fellows are able to contradict without blaspheming, in the view of all them that have eyes to see: for if they could, it should have been done by thee. And whereas thou sayest, "Fools must be meddling." Answer, It must needs be, that the saints of God should be called fools by the enemies of the man Christ Jesus without, because that the doctrine of the man Christ Jesus, crucified without for the sins of poor sinners, is also held to be foolishness by them; although it be the wisdom; and also the power of God, unto every one that believeth (1Cor 1:23,24).

And further, thou sayest, that the Pope can speak as much of Christ without, as I. Answer, friend, dost thou put no difference betwixt the speaking of Christ without, and believing in Christ without? I tell thee, though there may be many that can speak of the Christ of God without, yet there are but very few that can, or do believe indeed in him without, by the mighty operation of his Holy Spirit within. Nay, you yourselves do testify this, who deny that the salvation of sinners was completely wrought out by that one offering of Jesus Christ without upon the cross on Mount Calvary, and that he is ascentded from his disciples above the clouds, touching his bodily presence. (as in 2Cor 5:6 compared with Acts 1:9-11).

Then again thou sayest, "I do ask myself a question, and do also answer it myself deceitfully." The question is, Do not the scriptures make mention of a Christ within? And thou sayest, I answer it deceitfully myself. But I answer again, that I am not ashamed of the answer I then gave, because I know it is truth; and whereas thou sayest it is deceitful, and yet canst not find fault with any point thereof, it confirms me, that had there been falsity in it, such an enemy to the truth, as thou art, would have taken that advantage, as to have discovered, that thereby thou mightest have rendered the truth the more odious. The answer I shall leave to the Christian reader, which is so indeed; yet am confirmed myself concerning it, and shall give thee an answer to thy question, which is, Doth not the scriptures say, or witness, that all that have not Christ within are reprobates? Answer: Yes, the scripture saith so, and it is true, they that have not the Spirit of Christ in them, are reprobates. But there are some that are reprobates, that you will confess. Then by your own argument you must grant, that some have not the Spirit of Christ in them. Pray take notice, they that have not the Spirit of Christ in them are reprobates. There are some who are reprobates; therefore there are some who are sensual, "having not the Spirit of Christ in them" (see thy folly how it is made manifest.) (Jude 5:19). The next thing thou art offended withal, is, because I say, the devil deceives poor souls by persuading them to follow the light within which all men have. answer, friend, I say, again, and again, That there is nothing less than the Spirit of Christ, that can give a soul a sight of justification by the blood of the man Christ Jesus without, by following of it. Now as thou sayest thyself, some are reprobates, and have not the Spirit of Christ.

Then is it any heresy to say, that it is of the devil to persuade a soul to follow that light which is no better than conscience, or nature itself (Rom 2:14), which are not able to lead to Christ his things, being foolishness to it; or is conscience, which every one is lightened withal, the Spirit of Christ? give an answer in sincerity.

Then thou sayest, that my whole purpose is a secret smiting at the light wherewith Christ hath lightened every man. I answer, my whole design in my book, is, and was, these following things:-

1. To show souls, where salvation is to be had. Namely, in Christ without,

2. To show souls how they should lay hold of this salvation; namely, by the operation of the Spirit of Christ, which must be given within.

3.To forewarn poor souls, that they should not deceive themselves, neither by conscience, nor the law; which are both inferior, and much below the Spirit of Christ; even as much as he that buildeth the house, hath more honour than the house (Heb 3:3).

4. To show how poor souls should know, whether they had the Spirit of Christ, or not, within them, or whether the Spirit of the devil had exalted himself above the Spirit of Christ, by transforming himself into an angel of light.

Farther, thou thinkest I contradict myself, because I admonish poor souls to beg of God to convince them by his Holy Spirit; and thou sayest, This is my confusion. When alas, confusion is of, and from thyself, who wouldst make a defiled conscience, the law and the Spirit of Christ to be all one; as I shall further clear to the reader by and by.

But tell thee friend, there are many who have not the Spirit of Christ, and yet are convinced of sin by their own consciences (John 8:9). He doth not say, "by the light of Christ in their consciences," Mark that: Now I knowing, that a man may be convinced, and yet not by the Spirit of Christ (for he may be without that) but by nature itself (1Cor 11:14). I do admonish every soul if they love themselves, to beg of God for Jesus Christ his sake, that he would not only let them be convince by these poor, low, empty, beggarly things (their consciences) in respect of the Spirit of Christ, but that he would convince them by that Spirit of his effectually, which is not only able to show their lost state because of sins against the law, but also, to lead them to the right Saviour, and plant them into him, which all other things are not able to do. And thus much in answer to thy scolding against my epistle the truth of which I bless God through the strength of Christ, I could be willing to seal with my blood.

And now friend, in love to thy soul, I say, have a care of thyself, that thou do not satisfy thyself with anything, until thou seest by the operation of the Spirit of Christ (which thou must have given thee from heaven, as being without it before conversion) that the blood of that man Christ Jesus that was crucified on Mount Calvary, did at that same time, when it was there shed, wash thee from all thy sins, and be not so stout, and so stern against the truth, because it suits not with thy beguiled conscience. (bear with me in patience) and seriously inquire into the truth of things according to the scriptures. "For they are they that testify of Christ, and how salvation doth come by him."

In thy entering upon my book, the first thing I find thee wrangling with, is by corrupting my words, and then by calling me liar.

Thou corruptest my words saying, that I said, "the blood of Christ was shed before the world began." Whereas I said, that in the account of God, (mark, in the account of God) the blood of Christ was shed before the world began. Friend, art thou not able to distinguish, betwixt a thing being done in God's account, or according to his foreknowledge, and a thing at that is really and actually done. Surely it was either thy folly to speak evil of the thing thou knowest not, or else thy madness doth much appear, in that though thou understandest these things, yet for to wrangle by corrupting my sayings here, as also in other places, as will afterwards appear. this is in page 11, of thine, page 3, of my book.

Then thou goest on, page 12, and quotest the place where I say, page 37. How horribly are those deceived who look on Jesus (but thou leavest out those words, the Son of Mary) to be but a type; which thing you say, you know none that do. And again thou sayest, that I say, he is of something afterwards to be revealed. My words thou corruptest; thou wouldst fain gather thus much out of my words, by corrupting them. that though I denied Christ Jesus the Son of Mary to be a type, yet I myself say, He was a type, yet I myself say, He was a type of something afterward to be revealed. Which thing, as there in my book, so here again I do most positively deny, and I quote the same words again, for a second confirmation of the same, saying as then I died; "How horribly are those deceived, who look on Jesus the Son of Mary to be but a shadow, or type of something that was afterwards to be revealed." Whereas the scriptures most lively hold him forth to be the Christ of God; and not a type or shadow of a Spirit, or body afterwards to be revealed, but himself was the very substance of all things that did any way hold forth, or type out, Christ to come: And when he was indeed come, then was an end put to the law for righteousness or justification to every one that believeth (Rom 10:4). And therefore, friend, though thou hast, or wouldest corrupt my words, yet have a care of corrupting Christ's words, lest thou dost even heap up wrath against the day of wrath, and revelation of the righteous judgment of God. And whereas thou sayest, "Thou deniest not but Jesus is the substance." Answer, I doubt thou dost not speak thine heart plainly, but hidest thyself with so saying, as with an apron; if we inquire into what it is to hold froth Jesus the Son of Mary to be the substance. Therefor he that holds forth Jesus the Son of Mary to be indeed the substance, and not a type; holds forth and believes, that that Jesus that was born of the Virgin Mary, did in his own body of flesh fulfil the law, and impute the righteousness of his obedience unto them that he accomplished then without them; and that his blood that was shed without on the cross, doth, and hath washed away all sin past, present, and to come, from him that believeth his; as it is written, "For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, (that is, through our flesh.) God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:" That is, he was condemned in the flesh that he took on him of the Virgin Mary (Rom 8:3). And again, he bore our sins in his own body on the tree, which was the cross on Mount Calvary.

Jesus also (saith the apostle) that he might sanctify the people with his own blood, suffered: Where? Not in any believer, but without the gate of Jerusalem (Heb 13:12). How say you, do you really believe that at that time when Jesus did hang on the cross without Jerusalem's gate, even at that time he did give the justice of God a full and complete satisfaction for all the sins of all believers, that have been formerly, or are now, or hereafter shall be? Or do you look upon Jesus at that time to be but a shadow, or type of some what that was afterwards to be done within? Answer plainly, yea, or no; that the simple may understand you.

I now I come to answer thy query laid down, page 12, in these words; "Did Christ Jesus put an end to the law, for them who live yet in the transgression of the law condemned?" Indeed a right answer to this will be great satisfaction to some, though I think some trouble to others. And therefore in answer to thy question I shall lay down these following things:

Answ. 1. Christ Jesus did put an end to the law for righteousness, for all that shall be saved; for he shall not be offered a second time: No, "but once for all" (Heb 10:10). Once in the end of the world hath he appeared, to put away sin by the sacrifice of himself; and he hath done it once by himself for all (Heb 9:26). Otherwise he must have often suffered since the world began: But that must not be; for he "dieth no more" (Rom 6:9). But say you, "Did he put and end to the law for them who still live in transgression?"

Answ. 2. There are many poor souls that are given unto Christ, who yet live in their sins. But Christ did at that time, when he hanged on the cross, give a full and complete satisfaction for them. "In due time Christ died for the ungodly: For scarcely for a righteous man will one die, yet peradventure for a good man some would even dare to die." Ay, "But God commendeth his love towards us, in the, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us." while we were yet sinners, yet ungodly (Rom 5:6-8). Nay, he did not only die for those who still live in sin, but he also makes intercession now at the throne of his Father's grace for them. "And he made intercession for the transgressors" (Isa 53:12). "Thou hast ascended on high, thou hast led captivity captive;—and received gifts for men." For what men? Even "for the rebellious also." To what end? "That the Lord God might dwell among them" (Psa 68:38).

Answ. 3. That at that very time when Jesus Christ did hang on the cross on Mount Calvary, was buried, rose again from the dead, and ascended above the clouds from his disciples, at that very time was all the law fulfilled for righteousness. He is the end of the law, mark; he is the end of the law for righteousness. But if there were anything yet to be done for justification, which was not then done; there could not be an end put to the law for righteousness, for every one that believeth. But in that there is an end put to the law for righteousness by Jesus for all the elect of God, Christ having once fulfilled it for them: It is manifest, that there was not anything then left undone by Christ at that time, which was afterward to be done by his own Spirit in his children for justification, only believe what the man Christ, at that time did do, and saved (Acts 13:29-39); and whereas thou asketh, whether Christ did justify that which the law condemneth?

Answ. 4. I answer, Fourthly, That though Christ Jesus did not justify sins of ungodliness, yet he justifieth the ungodly. "Now to him that worketh is the reward [given, or] not reckoned of grace, but of debt. But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, (mark the ungodly) his faith is counted for righteousness" (Rom 4:4). He is he that justifieth, having finished the righteousness of the law in his own person for them. "Mine own arm brought salvation," saith he, but how? Even by his bleeding on the cross; "we have redemption through his blood" (Eph 1:7), which was shed without the gate (Heb 13:12). Ay, and though the law condemneth a sinner, yet let but that sinner believe in Christ, in what he hath done in his own person, and he shall be "justified from all things, from which he could not be justified by the law of Moses" (Acts 13:39).

And whereas thou asketh me the meaning of that scripture, "not one tittle of the law shall fail till all be fulfilled." I answer, That the law hath already been fulfilled for justification, for every one that believeth: And a believer is to do nothing for justification, only believe and be saved; though that law be a rule for every one that believeth to walk by, but not for justification. But if you do not put a difference between justification wrought by the man Christ without, and sanctification wrought by the Spirit of Christ, within; teaching believers their duty to their God, for his love in giving Christ; you are not able to divide the word aright: but contrariwise, you corrupt the word of God, and cast stumbling-blocks before the people; and will certainly one day most deeply smart for your folly, except you repent. Here is a plain answer that may satisfy the simple. The Lord God grant that they may lay it to heart effectually.

Now this I say further, that if God enable any to receive this doctrine aright ( namely what I said even now) it will more engage the soul to God, than all the threatenings, thunder-claps, and curses that come from the law itself. And a soul will do more for God, seeing itself redeemed by the blood of the Lamb the Son of Mary (John 1:29). than if he had all the conditions of the law to fulfil, and might be sure to have heaven for the fulfilling of them. Now as to the assurance thou speakest of at the end of thy question. I know in the first place, that though believers themselves do sin, yet they have "an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous;" (1John 2:1). And though the doctrine of the gospel be to abstain from all appearance of evil, yet our Lord Jesus Christ is so pitiful, as not altogether to deprive his children of an assurance of their salvation,2 though sometimes through weakness they do transgress. And whereas you would lay an assurance on our obedience to the law; I say, our assurance comes through our believing, and our obedience to the law is a fruit of our believing; for every one that hath this hope, that he is one of the children, or sons of God, by faith in Jesus (1John 3:3), "purifieth himself, even as he is pure." Holiness of life, if it be right, flows from an assurance of our being justified by Christ's death on the cross, on Mount Calvary; as it is written again, that he might sanctify his people with his own blood, he suffered without the gate.

But again, page 12. thou seemest offended, because I say, "They are deceived, who think to obtain salvation by following the law, which they call Christ, though falsely." Why shouldst thou be offended at this, when the scripture saith plainly, "That by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin" (Rom 3:20). But this is thy frothy argument, "The law convinceth, and is our schoolmaster to bring us to Christ; therefore the law is not taken away," sayest thou. Friend, what is this to the purpose? must we seek for justification by the works of the law, because the law convinceth? you may as well say, we must seek for justification from our consciences, because they do convince: Now where the scripture saith, the law was our schoolmaster to bring us to Christ; do you think it means, we must be first fitted by purification of ourselves by, or according to the law, before we can be saved by Christ from the curse of the law? If you say, yea; then doth not this follow, that Christ Jesus did not come to save sinners, but to save the righteous; and if so, then you must say, that Christ, Peter, Paul, and all the servants of the Lord are liars, who have testified that Christ died not for the godly, but for the ungodly and sinners.

But where the scripture saith, the law was our schoolmaster to bring us to Christ: I ask again, is it the ceremonial law, or the moral law that is meant in this place? If you say the moral, or the ten commandments, I answer; That doth not lead to life and so not to Christ; but is properly the ministration of condemnation (2Cor 3:6-11). That is, the proper work of the moral law, or ten commandments, is to condemn, if it be not obeyed; and yet not to bless, until it be every jot fulfilled, which is impossible to be done by any man for justification, in that exact and severe way which the law calls for; which makes the Apostle say, as many as are of the works of the law, are under the curse. Mark, he doth not say, as many as are of the works of sin, are under the curse, though that be true; but as many as are of the works of the law, are under the curse: "for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them. But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, it is evident: for, The just shall live by faith" (Gal 3:10,11).

If it be meant of the ceremonial law, as I am most inclinable to believe, because he saith it was our schoolmaster; he doth not say it is, but it was our schoolmaster to bring us to Christ, being tutor or governor; holding and significations forth, Christ to come by its types until the time appointed of the Father, which appointed time (and so that law) was to have an end, when God sent forth his Son made of a woman, Jesus the Son of Mary, who was made under the law, to redeem those that were under the law.

Now the ceremonial law did bring or lead to Christ these two ways: First, In that it did continue in full force until he did come into the world, and had done that which was by it held out for him to do.

Secondly, In that the several types and shadows, as the blood of bulls and lambs, with diverse other services did lead to, or hold forth Christ that was to come: But the moral law, or ten commandments, is so far from leading us to Christ by our following it, that it doth even lead those that are led by it under the curse. Not because the law hath an evil end in it, but because of our weakness and inability to do it; therefore it is forced, as it is just, to pass a sentence of condemnation on every one, that in every particular fulfils it not.

In the next place, thou art offended because I said, "It is not, for I do not know your fellows for boasting under heaven, in that you, (Pharisees like) do cry up yourselves to be the men, and condemns all others; when you are THE MEN that are the greatest enemies to the Christ of God without (who is the Saviour) of any men under heaven. And in that you pretend you are perfect, when you are the notablest liars and corrupters of the sayings of the people of God, yea, and of the scriptures also, that ever I came near in all the days of my life; and I doubt not but before I have done with you, I shall make it appear to them that read or hear my lines aright." the query in page 13. runs thus, "Will that faith which is without works justify?" I answer, No, neither will those works which are without faith sanctify. What then, Is it faith and works together that doth justify? No, it is only faith in the blood of the man Christ, that did hang on the cross on Mount Calvary, that doth justify in the sight of God and the soul, and it is the fruits of faith, good works, which do justify in the sight of men. So that when it is said, we are justified by works; it is not meant that works will justify in the sight of God. No, but shew me (or shew men) thy faith, of justify thy faith to be true and right before men by thy works. Shew men thy faith by thy works, it is in the sight of men. So that we conclude a man is justified, or made manifest to be indeed that which is right, both to believers, and to the world by its works. Though I must confess, that both Paul and Peter, and the rest of the saints, may sometimes be deceived in the truth of the faith of others by their works.

Again I page 17 thou seemest to be offended, because, I say "loving by faith, is to apply the Lord Jesus Christ, his benefits, as birth, righteousness, death, blood, resurrection, ascension, and intercession, together with the glorious benefits of his second coming to me, as mine, and for me, &c" (Gal 2:20).

Friend, methinks thou shouldest find no fault with this, but that the Man Christ Jesus, the Son of Mary, is not very pleasant to thee, because thou hast swallowed down secretly another doctrine; but friend, I speak of applying these things. and thou speakest of talking of them, I know that there are many who talk of Christ, that will fall short of heaven and glory.

But tell me, what sayest thou to him that doth apply all these things to his soul, is there not enough in them to justify him, that doth really and truly in the power of the Spirit, believe this to be true which I have said? or dost thou deny it and preach another gospel saith not, who shall ascend, to fetch Christ from above for salvation. Though there is never a scripture that saith these words, word for word; yet the scripture saith, "the word is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart; but mark, it is the word of faith, not the Man Christ Jesus, but faith which layeth hold on him" (Rom 10:8-9), which is this, "That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, (who was born of the Virgin, Matt 1:21) and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved." These great and precious scriptures, with which by corrupting of them, the Quakers have beguiled many, have this meaning, that if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus; that is, in profession and practice, own him, and believe him to be the anointed Saviour. And shalt believe in thine heart, that God raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved; "for with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation." But what should men believe with the heart? Namely this, that God raised him ( that is Christ) from the dead (verse 10). And therefore, I wonder thou shouldest so scold, as thou dost, against the truth: If this be not truth, blame the scriptures which do testify of these things for truth. For I am ruled and would be ruled by them through the Spirit.

But farther, thou art offended that I should say, "They are deceived who own Christ no otherwise than as he was before the world began." This question, I briefly ask thee, "Had Christ a body of flesh before the world began?" If you say no, as you must, if you say true; then do not I say true, when I say, they are deceived who own Christ no otherwise than as he was before the world began? because they own him not with that body of flesh which he took of the Virgin Mary; and so are antichrists, as the scripture saith. And how say you? Do you believe that the same Christ who was before the world, without a body, did in time come into the world and take a body from the Virgin, and in that body did obtain everlasting redemption for sinners?: and is gone with that very body into the presence of this Father above the clouds into heaven, from his saints on earth, though in them by his Spirit. A plain answer to this would unlock your double meanings. Again, thou sayest the saints drank of the spiritual rock that followed them.

Friend, I confess, that that spiritual rock that did follow the fathers, and long after, was from the same loins with them, even from the loins of Abraham, and the rest of the children of the promise, according to the promise, was the meat and drink of saints (Rom 9:4,5). But to look upon Christ no otherwise than as he was before the world was, which was a Spirit only, and not to own him now clothed with a body, absent from his children touching the same body, I dare be bold to say, they are no Christians, but antichristians, yea antichrists. He that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is antichrist, and of antichrist. Again,

At this also thou wranglest, because I said that "every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ, who was with the Father before the world was, did in the appointed time of the Father, come into the world, take a body upon him, and was very Man as well as very God: and did in the very body suffer what did belong to the sons of men, &c." So my book, page 42, 43, 44. I answer, if thou didst indeed believe the truth, thou wouldest own these things. But being deceived, rather that thou wilt let his pass for truth, though thou wilt put on a vail, and venture upon it thus, saying, "If every spirit were of God, which doth confess in words this, then is not the Pope himself antichrist."

Answ. Friend, it is one thing to confess the things in words and another thing to believe them, and to make a life out of them; and there fore is thy life made out of Christ without thee, by the operation of his Spirit within thee, yea or no? then in answer to my bidding people receive no Christ except God's Christ, thou sayest thus, "That Christ is a mystery, and unto him is light, and shall be salvation where his person never came." this question I ask thee, did or doth Christ obtain salvation for any, without that body which he took of the Virgin? And yet thou sayest, it cannot be said, here is the place where the Son is not.

I answer: As the Son of God is also very Man, so it may be said, here is the place where he is not, and there is the place where he hath not been, though as he is God it is otherwise: lit him that reads understand.

And now passing by many things that I might justly examine, and also many unseemly expressions, I come to the next thing, and that is, where you say, you wrest not the scriptures in John 1:9. But it is evident, that you do most horribly wrest it, in the you, though you seem to take it in the plain words, yet would hold, that that light is the Spirit of Christ, notwithstanding here is no such thing mentioned in that scripture. For mark, as I have sometimes said, and now also will say, that that light wherewith Christ, as he is God, hath lightened every one with, is not the Spirit of Christ, as is clear, in that some are sensual having not the Spirit, which they must needs have, if it were given to every one that comes into the world, and therefore, in that you say, I say you lay down that scripture false; I say again, that you say many things which I do know to be blasphemy, as I shall prove clearly anon, as also I have already. And therefore, to take thee of from this, I shall say, that Christ as he is a mediator, a Man between God and man, so he doth not lighten every man that comes into the world, though as he is God he doth. And this is manifest, where he often, (as he was Man) saith, These things are spoken to them that are without in parables; "that seeing they might not see, and hearing they might not understand," (Luke 8:10). And again, where Judas (not Iscariot) said; Lord, how is it, that thou wilt manifest thyself to us, and not unto the world? He saith, "If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we (I as mediator, and my Father as reconciled in me) will come unto him, and make our abode with him" (John 14:23). And again, "No man knoweth him as a father, but the Son, and he to whom the Son will reveal him (Matt 11:27). But above all, take that scripture where the Son saith, "I thank thee O Father, Lord of heaven and earth, because thou hast hid these things from the wise and prudent, and hast revealed them unto babes" (verse 25). Here the Son and the Father are speaking one to another; the Father he hides the glorious things of the gospel from the, world (Matt 11:25-27), and the Son he rejoices in so doing. At the same hour Jesus rejoiced in Spirit, and said, "I thank thee, O Father, &c. Therefore understand thus much, that though Christ as he is God, doth give to every man a light, which is conscience, otherwise called nature (Rom 2:14; 1Cor 11;14), yet it doth not follow, that every man hath enlightening from Christ as he is mediator. No, Christ as he is mediator doth neither pray for the world (John 17:9), neither doth he give his Spirit to all that are in the world; for some are sensual, and have it not. But now the argument that thou dost bring to colour the contrary with, is this; for what the Father doth, sayest thou, the Son doth also. Answ. Though this be true, that the Son doth what the Father doth; yet it doth not appear that either the Father or the son hath given the Spirit to every one that comes into the world (Jude 19).

Again thou sayest, thou deniest those that say, "That light which every one hath as he comes into the world, is conscience; though some call it Christ falsely." Answ. Friend, What wilt thou have it called; Christ. No, if not conscience, then call it nature itself; for all have not the Spirit.

But another great argument thou bringest in page 15, is, "The light of Christ doth convince of sin." Now do you call conscience the light of Christ? that will convince of sin (John 8:9). And they being convinced by their own consciences, &c. if thou dost call the law the light of Christ, that also will convince of or make known sin; For by the law is the knowledge of sin (Rom 3:20). If thou dost call even nature itself, the light of Christ; That also doth shew, that sins are a shame, even those sins which some leap over (1Cor 11:14), and ruffian-like they will wear long hair, which nature itself forbiddeth, and is commended for the same by the apostle. The Spirit of Christ also will convince of sin. That, because these several things will convince of sin, therefore will they needs be the Spirit of Christ? Or do they altogether make but one Spirit of Christ? dost thou profess thyself to walk in the light, and art not able to know these things; Or, if thou dost know them art thou so unfaithful as not to tell poor people of them, who are some of them at their wits end, by reason they are not enlightened into these things.

Another of thy arguments is, "They saw the eternal power and Godhead, by that which was made manifest of God in them."

[I reply] The scripture say not so word for word, but thus: "Because that which might be known of God, was manifested in them." But how? for he hath shewed it unto them. But how? why the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, (which words in thy charge against me thou didst leave out) but mark: The invisible things of God from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made. But how then doth it say, that the knowledge of God is manifested in them? Why, because God hath shewed it unto them by the things that are made, even by the creation of the world. so that this scripture holdeth forth thus much; that the invisible things of God, as his power, holiness, and common goodness to the sons of men are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made. But how feeble an argument is this, to prove such a doctrine as this: That every one hath the Spirit when this light discovers God only by his works in the world. Friend, if they that know God, because he doth shew himself to them by his works in the world, have the Spirit of Christ, then the same argument will serve to speak thus much; that the devils themselves have the Spirit of Christ, which would be wonderful blasphemy once to affirm. And friend, the very devils, both for the knowledge of sin, and also for the knowledge of God's eternal power and Godhead, have more experience than all the unregenerate men in the world; and yet have not the least spark of the Spirit of Christ in them.

Other lame arguments thou tumblest over, like a blind man in a thicket of bushes, which I pass by. But one thing more thou hast, and that is this,

Thou askest me "whether I do know this light which god and Christ hath given to every man" (Rom 2:14; 1Cor 11:14)? First, I deny that Christ as he is mediator, hath given to every man his Spirit. And Secondly, I deny, that Christ as he is God hath given to every one his Spirit; but this I say as I have often said, it is conscience of nature itself that every one hath, take it in either of these scripture terms, as I have proved at large. And whereas thou askest me, "Whether that light, which Christ as he is God hath lightened every one with that comes into the world, be sufficient in itself for life and salvation." I answer plainly, no; for then Christ Jesus needed not to have come into the world to die for sinners; for every one had that light before Christ did come into the world.

2. And secondly I answer, it is not able, for then it would have been a needles thing for Christ to tell his disciples of sending them his Spirit, to lead them into all truth. The might have said, why dost thou talk of sending us they Spirit, who have that that can do the deed already, if that could have done it.

3. Because the scripture saith, "some are sensual, not having the Spirit." Now a man cannot lay hold on Christ, nor believe in him savingly without the Spirit, because faith is the work of the Spirit.

4. Because then it had been in vain for the Lord to have given the scriptures to teach men out of, either concerning himself or themselves: Why? because without it, they had a sufficient light to guide them: that thing must not be so.

And whereas thou asketh, whether the fault be then in God, or in that thou callest his light, or in the creature? I answer; What if God willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much patience the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction; and that he might make know the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore (before the world was, Eph 1:4) ordained unto glory? And secondly, O vain man! What is that to thee if God should make some vessels to dishonour: hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to do therewith as he pleases (Rom 9:16-22).

And where I say, "Christ as he is God hath lightened every one that cometh into the world:" to it thou givest a glavering answer; but having touched on this before, I pass it by.

To the next thing, where I say, "men's neglecting this light, or law, will be sure to damn them, though their obedience to the law will not save them." Here thou sayest I have confessed truth, (and I know it is true by experience) and thou commentest on those things laid down by me thus: "Then surely (sayest thou ) I t is good not to neglect it; "that is, not to neglect following the law. To which I answer, as their obedience to the law will not save them, so their neglect of obedience to the law will be sure to damn them; these things thou canst not deny. But is this all the wit thou hast? Because the neglect of the law will be sure to damn them; therefore wouldst thou put poor souls to follow that which will not save them? (O wonderful ignorance.) Nay, but thou shouldest have said, then surely the best course is, for a poor soul in this case, to fly to the Lord Christ, even the Man Christ Jesus, who was slain on Mount Calvary for the sins of poor sinners. And the rather, because he did so willingly, of his own accord lay down his life for them. Methinks, I say, thou shouldest rather have said, then lit us follow the Son of Mary, the Man Christ Jesus, the Lamb of God that takest away the sins of the world, by his blood on the cross; who is now also at his Father's right hand making intercession for all those that do come to the Father by him; but they that are not for the truth, will advance anything but the truth. And as for that which thou callest the second clause, which is. The law (sayest thou) must by obeyed.

I answer, Christ Jesus hath done that in his own person, and justified me thereby, and for my part, I will not labour now to fulfil the law for justification, least I should undervalue the merits of the Man Christ Jesus, and what he hath done without me: and yet will I labour to fulfil, if it were possible, then thousand laws, if they were so many; An O! let it be out of love to my sweet Lord Jesus (2Cor 5:14) "for the love of Christ constrains me." And thus much to thy 16th page.

In the next place, thou art offended with this, because I say, though Christ doth give a light to every one that comes into the world, yet it doth not therefore follow, that this conscience, (or light) is the Spirit of Christ, or the work of grace wrought in the heart of any believer. This I shall pass also, as having spoken to it already, only mind thee of they weakness, in that thou shouldest make this conscience, that Christ hath given to every man, to be the same with the Spirit of Christ. And thou sayest further, that the light, that Christ hath lightened every one with, is the same in nature with the Spirit of Christ. O wonderful! that a man should be so foolish, and so much besides the truth, as to compare that nature, or conscience, that is given to every man; equal to the Spirit of Christ: nay, thou sayest that it is one with it in nature. Didst thou not blush when thou laidst it down? if thou didst not, thou mightest have done with shame enough. As I said before, because thy conscience will convince thee of sin, therefore the law must be called Christ, or as good as Christ. What! because the law will convince of sin, therefore the law must be called Christ. What ignorance is this? Nay, nature itself, that must have the pre-eminency, even as high as Christ Jesus, because it can tell a man that it is a shame for him to wear long hair.

Then thou askest me, can there be a surer thing for the creature to walk by, than by the light of Christ, which thou confessest every one hath, that cometh into the world. Answer, Friend, to the law, and to the testimony (sayeth the scriptures) for they testify of Christ. And if thou or any else, shall leave the scriptures, to follow the convictions of their own conscience; ye are not like to know Christ Jesus the Lord, for they may be defiled. And again, it is through the promises laid down in the scriptures, "that we might be partakers of the divine nature" (2Peter 1:4), and not by our following of the law, or conscience (Gal 3:1-4).

But again, where I say, Heathens, Turks, Jews, Atheists, &c. have that which doth convince of sin, and yet are so far from having the Spirit of Christ in them, that they delight to do iniquity; and serve their lust. Upon this thou movest this query; do they, or I, or any other, serve sin and lust, because Christ hath not given us light, or because we hate this light.

Ans. This I do really confess, that every Heathen, Turk, or Jew, in this world, hath a conscience within them, that doth convince of sin; for the Gentiles which have not the law, that is, not the law in tables of stone, or written as we have; these do by nature, the things contained in the law; these having not the law, are a law unto them selves; which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their consciences also bearing them witness, &c. And all men and women shall be left without excuse, even by the convictions of their own consciences, or the law. But now that these things are the Spirit of Christ, that I deny. For conscience is but a creature, a faculty of the soul of man, which God hath made. Neither is the law the Spirit of Christ; for the law is not of faith. They that are of the works of the law, are under the curse, but they that have the spirit of Christ they are the children of God, and under grace, and delivered from the curse, as it is written (Gal 3:10) "As many as are of the words of the law are under the curse." But what is it to be of the works of the law, or under the law? Ans. Why to seek to be justified by their obedience to the law. "Israel which followed after the law of righteousness," mark. They that follow after righteousness, do not attain to the law of righteousness; if they seek it not by faith: but as it were by the works of the law (Rom 9:30,31). But "Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being ( in our nature) made a curse for us" (Gal 3:10-13).

But whereas thou sayest, this conscience or law, which you would fain have called the Spirit of Christ, works in all men either to justify, or condemn. I do plainly deny, that either conscience, or the law can justify, though they can condemn. Mark, The law is called the ministration of condemnation, but not of life.

The gospel is called the ministration of life, but not of condemnation. (2Cor 3:9). The law was given that sin might be discovered. The gospel was sent, that sin might be taken away. The law worketh wrath; but the gospel is a gospel of peace (Rom 10). "The law made nothing perfect" (Heb 7:19). But Christ justifieth from all those things from which we could not be justified by the law of Moses (Acts 13:39).

And whereas thou askest me whether any thing doth convince of sin contrary to, or besides the Spirit of Christ.

I answer. There is conscience, and the law, yea, and nature itself that doth convince of son; as before I have proved at large. Yet neither is conscience, that law; or nature itself the Spirit of Christ; no, but are much inferior to it, as being things of no glory in respect of it.

And again, that something doth convince of sin besides the Spirit of Christ, it is evident, for the law saith, "Cursed is every on e that continueth not in all things which are written in it to do them" (Gal 3:10). But the Spirit convinceth men of their unbelief, together with other sins. Now mark, The law also convinceth to work for life, the Spirit convinceth to believe for life; the law saith, He that doth not fulfil me, shall be damned. The Spirit saith, He that believeth in Christ shall be saved. Now observe the terms of the law and of the gospel, are different one from another as to justification. If men seek for life by the law; then the law saith, Fulfil me perfectly, and thou shalt live. The spirit saith, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save those that by transgression had broken the law. For, for this cause saith the Spirit "He (Jesus the Son of Mary, the Man Christ between God and us 1Tim 2:5) is the mediator of the New Testament." For what? "that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions that were under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance" (Heb 9:15). Now I would not be mistaken; I do not say, that the Spirit of Christ doth give the least liberty to sin; God forbid. But its convictions are of a more saving and refreshing nature than the convictions of the law, and do more constrain the soul to holiness than that.

The law saying, work for life; the Spirit saying, "Now to him that worketh not, (for life) but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness" (Rom 4:5), as thus, if I should owe to two creditors ten thousand talents; the one should say unto me, thou owest me five thousand talents, pay that thou owest; the other should say, thou owest me five thousand talents, and I frankly and freely forgive thee all. Now these expressions are contrary one to another: even so is the end of the convictions of the law, not according to the end of the convictions of the Spirit of Christ; the one saying, pay me that thou owest, the other saying, thou art frankly and freely forgiven all.

The next thing thou utterest is, where I say, "Those that are alive unto sins, have not the Spirit of Christ." But sayst thou, it is given to every man. Mark, thou sayest, It is given to every man. The apostle saith, some are sensual, having not the Spirit (Jude 19). Who must we now believe, the Apostle or you? Certainly your doctrine is not according to truth, but a lie; as is clear, in the you will affirm, that which the Apostle doth deny.

Then thou sayest, I bring other vain arguments to prove that every one hath not the Spirit of Christ. This one is enough to prove it, that the Apostle saith, Some men have it not. But that which thou callest vain, I am sure neither thou nor any of they fellows, are able to answer. One is to this purpose; the devils are so convinced of son, that they did fear the torment that was to come upon them for their sins; and did fear also that the son of Man was come to torment them for their sins, and yet the devils have not the spirit of Christ. so that it is evident, that we may be convinced of sin, and yet not by the Spirit of Christ. A second argument which thou callest vain, is this, Man in his coming into the world, hath his conscience given him, which doth convince of sin (John 8:9), yet man in his coming into the world, or as he cometh into the world, hath not the Spirit of Christ given him, for that must be received ordinarily afterward by the preaching of the word, which is preached by the ministers and servants of Jesus Christ (Acts 10:44). "while Peter yet spake" to the people, "the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word."

But farther, thou sayest, "Until I prove the light of Christ contrary to the Spirit of Christ, thou wilt say, that every man hath that which is one in union, and like the Spirit of Christ, even as good as the Spirit of Christ in its measure."

Answer. Friend, I have proved already that every man hath not the Spirit of Christ, though they have that which thou dost call the Spirit of Christ, which is conscience and nature itself. And this I say again, that thou hast laid open thy weakness very much, to say that every man hath that which is as good as the Spirit of Christ, Friend, seeing the scriptures say, some have not the Spirit of Christ, how durst thou so blaspheme, as to say, then it is as good as the Spirit of Christ in its measure. Was there ever such a deal of ignorance discovered at one time by man, as to say, that every man hath the spirit, or that which is as good as the Spirit; though the Spirit saith plainly, that some have not the Spirit, as I have proved plainly (Jude 19). Friend, what is there besides the Spirit that is as good as the Spirit. Be silent, and say no more so, lest thou dost through ignorance, or presumption, set up thy conscience or nature, as high and as good as the Spirit of Christ, when indeed they are not worthy to be compared with it, being weak, and not able to do that which is and hath been done by the Spirit of Christ.

Then thou art offended, because I said the devil doth deceive poor souls by bidding them listen within, and see if there be not that which doth convince of sin. friend, all men have not the Spirit, though they have that conscience that doth convince of son (John 8:9). Now seeing all men have not the Spirit, is it not a great deceit of the devil to persuade poor souls, that because they are convinced for son by their own consciences, therefore they have the Spirit of Christ: surely it is from the devil. Because he would make thee believe that conscience, which is but a creature, is the Spirit of Christ, by whom the world was made. Again, because the soul, being persuaded that it hath the Spirit (when it hath it not) as all men naturally are without it (Eph 5:13,14), it is kept off from seeking and begging for it, being already persuaded (falsely) that it hath it.

And whereas thou sayest, the voice of the gospel is to bid listen within the heart, as Paul preacheth. I deny that Paul biddeth listen within. But the scripture that you would fain make shelter for your error is this, where he saith, "The word is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart" (Rom 10:8). That is, The word of faith which we preach. Now, Friend, faith is that which layeth hold of, or believeth the gospel. And that his is the meaning read the next verse: That (saith he) "If thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raise him from the dead, thou shalt be saved." so that it is clear that the word of faith, is to believe assuredly from the very heart, that God hath raised up Jesus from the dead, out of the grave into which he was laid by Joseph; and that he was raised again for my justification (Rom 4:25), as it is written (1Cor 15), "Moreover brethren (saith he,) I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you" at the first, "which also you have received, and wherein ye stand, by which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory, ( or assuredly believe,) what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain." but what was that gospel you preached? why, saith he (verse 3), "I delivered unto you first of all, that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; and that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures: and that he was seen of—the brethren after his resurrection," &c. the word of the gospel, my friend, is, Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures, and that he rose again according to the scriptures, and that he is ascended from his disciples, to prepare a place for them according to the scripture.

That he ever liveth to make intercession in his own person without, as mediator between God and man, according to the scripture (Heb 7:25).

That he will come again in the clouds with all his mighty angels, and before him shall all nation be gathered, according to the scriptures (1Thess 4:16,17; Matt 25:31,32), after which time, his saints shall be ever with him according to the scriptures.

Again, thou art offended in that I said, Now the poor soul finding this to be so (that it is convinced of sin) all in haste (if it be willing to profess) through ignorance of the gospel, claps in with the motions of its own conscience, which doth command to abstain from this evil, and to practise that good. Which words of mine thou corruptest, and wrestest, and layest down in another form, as are to be seen in thy book, page 18. But now, friend, is not he ignorant of the gospel, which thinks his own conscience will lead him to eternal life, by commanding to abstain from this evil, and practise that good? Surely, if salvation comes by our conscience, or by the convictions or commands thereof, Christ Jesus died for nothing (Gal 2:21).

And whereas thou askest, what, and how doth the light of the gospel work, if not in the conscience. I answer, Though the light of the Spirit of God and the gospel light is hid, and dith not shine so much as unto, much less into the consciences of some of them that be lost (2Cor 4:3,4) that though the light of the gospel dith shine, and that gloriously too in the hearts of God's elect, yet it dith not follow, that the convictions of conscience is the gospel; no, nor the convictions of the law neither. And again, though every one of God's elect have the light of the glorious gospel shining in them, what argument is this to prove all men have the light of the gospel shining in them. No, saith Christ, "I thank thee, O Father, because thou hast hid these things (the things of the gospel) from the wise and prudent, and hast revealed them unto babes" (Matt 12:25). And whereas thou sayest (as I gather by thy words) that I call conscience the light of Christ, I say, if thou meanest by these words (the light of Christ) the Spirit of Christ, I do deny that every man hath it: but if thou callest conscience the light of Christ, or the highest light that is in an unconverted man the light of Christ; then, I say, that the highest light that is in a natural or unconverted man (which you call the light of Christ) is not able by all its motions an convictions, nor yet by all the obedience that a man ca yield to these convictions; I say, they are not able to deliver him from the wrath to come; for deliverance from that s obtained by the blood of Jesus, which was shed on the cross, without the gate of Jerusalem (as I have often said) (Eph 1:7 compared with Heb 13:12). and not any light within a natural man.

And whereas thou sayest that I said, the devil counterfeits the new birth by persuading to follow the light of the world. I answer, 3 Thou hast most naughtily belied me. The words that I said (speaking of the devil before) are these; Now he counterfeits the new birth (said) by persuading them that it is wrought by following the light that they brought into the world with them; as is clearly seen in my book, page 76. Friend, I wonder that you should so boldly profess yourself to be led by the Spirit of Christ, when you make it manifest that you are guided by the spirit of Satan. Was not he a liar? and hast not thou been led by a lying spirit also, in wresting of my words as thou hast done?

But I do freely declare again, that Satan doth deceive those souls, whom he persuades the new birth is wrought in, by following the light they brought into the world with them; for men as they come into the world, do not receive the Spirit, for it is given to the elect afterwards; neither have all men the Spirit. And he that hath the new birth, must have it by, and through the Spirit; as it is written, "Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God." Therefore, if men do not bring the Spirit into the world with them; and if nothing without the Spirit, or nothing but the Spirit, will or can work the new birth in a man: it must needs follow, that they who think the new birth is wrought by that light or conscience which they brought into the world with them, must needs be beguiled by Satan.

I do pass by many of thy raging expressions, which I might justly charge with much unrighteousness; but I know the time is short, and then whatsoever thou has done in secret, shall be laid open upon the house tops, therefore I forbear them.

Again, thou art offended because I said, now Satan makes the soul believe he is its friend, and that he is a gospel minister (2Cor 11:14), and if the soul will be led by what shall be made known to it, from the light or conscience within, it shall not need to fear, but it shall do well, page 76. of my book [153]. I said it then, and I say it now; and I know that he that doth think to be born again by following his conscience, or any other light that is in an unregenerate man, will be deceived, and shall one day know, that there is a difference between conscience and Christ; between the light of nature, and the Spirit of God.

Quest. But you may say, how can you prove that conscience is not of the same nature, of the Spirit of Christ?

Answ. 1. They that are unbelieving, even their conscience is defiled. Tit. i. 15. But so cannot be the Spirit of Christ.

Answ. 2. Conscience is not of the same nature with the Spirit of Christ, for conscience may be hardened or seared with an hot iron: as it is written (1Tim 4:2). But so cannot be the Spirit of Christ.

Answ. 3. Our consciences naturally are evil, "having (saith the scripture) our hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience" (Heb 10:22). But so is not the Spirit of Christ.

But again whereas you said, that I said, they will not speak except the Spirit move the, &c thou dost falsely speak of me, and dost corrupt my words; for I said, How they will not speak except their spirit move them, (I do not say the Spirit of Christ) (said I) Friend; if you can be lead to life by your own spirit, if your own spirit will learn you the things of the Spirit of God; and if you can speak them with and in your own spirit, in the demonstration that they are spoken, when they are spoken in the Spirit of Christ; (which all men have not) then say that I speak false things; but till that time hold your peace. Thus I pass by they 20. page, leaving many of thy scolding terms to thyself. The next thing you sayest Is, that I did run but was not sent, like unto my forefathers: and therefore sayest thou, I do not profit the people at all. Answ. Which accusation of thine, I shall leave to be taken notice of by the people of God in the country where I dwell, who will testify the contrary for me, setting aside the carnal ministry, with their retinue; who are as mad against me as thyself.

But farther, thou art somewhat distempered, and discontented that I said, "Many sad and horrible doctrines are vented by you," And your said, I named nothing. Answ. I need not, thine own speech betrayeth thee, that thou art one of them, that do such things; and I need go no further than thy own mouth and doctrine. But if it will be more satisfaction to tell you wherein, they or your society do hold sad doctrine I shall.

1. Therefore your society do hold and affirm, that that man which was hanged on the cross between two thieves, called Jesus; in his person is within you, contrary to the scripture (Acts 1:11).

2. You say that Christ is crucified within, dead within risen and ascended within; which also you have no word of scripture to prove.

3. Your society affirm, that the coming of the Spirit into the hearts of believers do plainly hold forth, that the coming of Christ in the spirit was before his coming in the flesh; as in 1Peter 1:10,11 where the apostle speaking of the prophets inquiring into the great salvation which was afterwards to be accomplished, saith, "searching what, of what manner of time the Spirit of Christ which was in them did signify, when it testified before hand the sufferings of Christ, and the glory that should follow." Mark, here is the Spirit of Christ in the prophets, long before the first coming of Christ in the flesh, which was when he was born of Mary the Virgin, the Spirit of Christ, saith he, did testify before hand the suffering of Christ, to the prophets, which were before Christ came in the flesh, as the scriptures hold forth plentifully.

4. But again, you deny the second coming of that very Man, with that very body, which was born of the Virgin Mary; and say, his second coming is not his coming again personally, but his coming in the Spirit only; and that is all you look for, when the scripture saith; That same Jesus (who appeared to his disciples after his passion (Acts 1:3)), shall so come, even as they did see him depart from them into heaven; which was a very Man, as well as very God. And will come again, a very Man, as well as very God, at the end of the world. For it is that Man; namely, he that was crucified, whom God raised again, must be the judge of quick and dead (Acts 10:39-42. seriously compared).

5. Again, you say, that every man hath the spirit of Christ, which is a sad doctrine, because contrary to the scripture (Jude 19). And you say, there is that in every man which is as good as the Spirit of Christ; which is a blasphemous doctrine. Besides many other things which they of your own spirit have most sadly spoken; which I shall not mention, being so commonly known to the saints of the Lord, before whom you have openly, and without fear (at least in shew) spoken. Which will doubtless be laid open to your sorrow and great amazement, at the appearing of our Lord Jesus Christ.

Then thou art offended because I said, I wonder that the Lord doth not either cause the ground to open her mouth and swallow you up: or else suffer the devil to fetch you away, to the astonishing the whole world. Certainly, Korah, Dathan, and Abiram did not so horribly transgress, as you have it were the astonishment of the world. Therefore I may well wonder that you are not served so. Only this I consider, it may be, you have not yet filled up the measure of your wickedness; therefor is not the hand of God as yet upon you.

The next thing I take notice of is, that thou findest fault with mine answer to this question. "But doth not the scripture say, that it is the Spirit of Christ that doth convince of sin?" Thou sayest it is a good question, but I have confounded it in the answer, and not answered plainly. Wherefore I shall not at all stick at the pains, to give the reader in brief some of the heads of the answer I then gave to it word for word, or to the same purpose. The answer was, yes, that Spirit doth convince of sin; but for the better understanding of this place, I shall lay down this, said I, That there are two things spoken of in scripture, that do manifest or convince of sin. First, the law (Rom 3:20). "For by the law is the knowledge of sin." Secondly, the Spirit of Christ doth also the same, as it is written, "And when he is come, he will 4convince the world of sin" (John 16:7-9). Now say I, sometimes the law itself, by its own power doth manifest sin, as in the case of Judas, who was so far from having the Spirit of Christ, that the devil had very great possession of him. Which things my adversary doth wrangle at, yet dares not affirm the contrary: only saith this, he had the righteous law of God written in his heart: which thing is not the Spirit of Christ. The law in not of faith. The law is not the comforter, but rather a tormentor: yet the Spirit of Christ is a comforter. Again say I, the Spirit of Christ doth take the law, and doth effectually convince of sin, &c. Then I put forth another question, saying, "But how should I know whether I am convinced by the law alone, or whether the law be effectually set home by the spirit?" To which I answer, when the law doth convince by its own power, it doth convince only of sins against the law; as lying, swearing, stealing, &c. pronouncing an horrible curse against thee if thou fulfil it not, and there leaves thee, but gives thee no power to fulfil it completely and continually, which thou must do, if thou be saved thereby. With which my adversary is much offended; also saying, that I am confounded in my discourse, and so leaves me, confuting none of my words by holy scripture, but falls a railing, because I reckon Pharisees and Quakers together.

Only this much he saith; That I make it a light thing to be convinced by the law, and then brings in that scripture; "this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men love darkness rather than light;" cunningly corrupting of it, and would fain have you understand it as spoken of the law, when the son of Mary speaks it of himself, which was not the law, but the Saviour. And that he might the better go away undiscerned, he saith, and the law is light, therefor the light is the law (saith he). But I perceive that he doth not yet understand the difference between the light of the law, and the light of the gospel; but would fain make the law and Christ one Saviour: the one being but only a condemning light, and nothing else; the other a saving comfortable light. And whereas thou sayest, I make it a light thing to be convinced by the law, I answer; the law is good, if a man use it lawfully; and I hour it in its place; yet if they make a Saviour if it, they make an idol of it, and wrest it out of its proper place. Also, if they think that it is Christ, they are much deceived.

But farther, he put me to prove any such distinction in scripture as that there is anything made mention of therein that doth convince of son, beside the Spirit of Christ: which thing I have already answered, where I said the scripture saith, "By the law is the knowledge of sin" (Rom 2:20), and again, doth not even nature itself teach you, that it is a shame for a man to wear long hair (1Cor 11:14), and also conscience, which are neither of them the spirit of Christ, but much inferior to the same; yet this also convinceth of sin (John 8:9).

But to the other thing, which is the answer that I give in my book to this objection: But I am not only convinced of my sins (may some say) but have also some power against my sins; so that I do in some measure abstain from the sins forbidden in the law. And because I say, this thou mayest have and do, as thou thinkest, perfectly too [as thou thinks, mark that] as those fond hypocrites, called Quakers [think] that they also do, and yet be but a natural man. Here my adversary is very much offended, and calls me perverter of the right way of the Lord; and saith, Shew me any natural man in the scripture that hath done it. Whereas had he been but willing to have laid down the scripture I brought to prove it, he needed not to have looked for a second answer. But because he would have it again, I will therefore shew you, that natural men merely by nature may be convinced, and abstain from those things forbidden in the law, and think they do it perfectly, nay, they do the things contained in the law. For saith the apostle (Rom 2:14), "when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature [mark, do by nature] the things contained in the law, these, [the Gentiles] having not the law, are a law unto themselves." Mark; the Gentiles do by nature the things contained in, or held forth, or made mention of by the law; the light also that they have, it is themselves, being a law to themselves; that is, their consciences (being of themselves) bearing them witness and their thoughts the meanwhile accusing, or else excusing one another (verse 15), though they cannot be saved thereby.

Again, when Paul was a natural man, and a persecutor of Jesus Christ, he saith of himself, that then he was, "touching the righteousness which is in the law, blameless" (Phil 3:6). And whereas thou sayest, thou hadst rather choose to be one of those who abstain from those things forbidden in the law, and to have power over sin, than to live in the transgression of the law; this is fair spoken, and it doth shew that thou art under the convictions of the law; and if it be no worse, I fear thy state the less, though it be bad enough; yet this I say, If thy soul be not saved freely by the blood of that man who was crucified on Mount Calvary, and by his merits alone done by himself in his own person, thou, notwithstanding wilt fall short of eternal life. for by the works of the law, shall no flesh living be justified (Rom 3:20). Though by it be the knowledge of sin, and a command to abstain from the same. And thus have I spoken to thy 21 page.

But farther thou sayest, that thou fearest I worship the name Mary, because I mention her name so much.

[I reply] If thou hadst said, I worship her Son, thou hadst said truly (I hope) But is not thy spite more against her son, than her? I doubt it is; for neither thou, nor they companions can endure that one should say, he is still the same that was born Mary, flesh and bones, a very man, now absent from his people, though in them in his Spirit.

Again, thou sayest I said, "That as he is God, Christ lighteneth every man that comes into the world; "which thing again I say. What then? Then say you, I will mind you of one scripture which you yourself have quoted, which saith "The law is light" (Prov 6:23). Therefore sayest thou, "The light is the law." Give me leave here to take thy words in twain:

First, if when thou sayest, then the law is light, thou mean, the light of the law is the light of the law, and no more, thou sayest right. But if thou mean the light of the law, is the light of the gospel, or the Spirit of Christ, I must needs reprove thee. For I tell thee again, the law is not of faith, the law makes nothing perfect (Heb 7:19). The law is but a weak and unprofitable thing, as to justification (Heb 7:18), though as I said before, it is good if it be used lawfully; which is, not to seek or look for justification thereby, nor yet to say, it is the sprit of Christ.

Then farther thou art offended, because I said, when the spirit of Christ convinceth, it convinceth of more sins than the sins against the law. Friend, will the law shew a man that his righteousness is sin and dung? No, for though the law will shew a man that his failing in the acts of righteousness is sin; yet I question, whether the law will shew, that a man's own righteousness is sin. For there is in scripture [that which] saith it doth, or can.

Secondly, shew me, if thou canst, that the sin of unbelief is spoken against in all the ten commandments, or that called the moral law. But now the Spirit of Christ convinceth of unbelief, that is, it sheweth, that if men do not believe, that they have redemption by the obedience of that man who was laid in the manger, hanged on the cross, &c. I say, it sheweth, that those who do not lay hold on what he hath done and suffered without them in his own body on the tree (through the operation of his Spirit, which he hath promised to give to them that ask him) or else they have not yet been convinced of the sin of unbelief, and so are still in a perishing condition; notwithstanding their strict obedience, to the light within them, or to the law. And now tell me, you that desire to mingle the law and the gospel together, and to make of both one and the same gospel of Christ: did you ever see yourselves undone and lost, unless the righteousness, blood, death, resurrection and intercession of the man Christ Jesus (in his own person) was imputed to you? and until you could by faith own it as done for you, and counted yours by reputation, yea, or no? Nay rather, have you not set up your consciences, and the law, and counted your obedience to them better, and more value, that the obedience of the son of Mary without you, to be imputed to you? and if so, it is because you have not been savingly convinced by the Spirit of Christ, of the sin of unbelief.

Other things thou dost quarrel against, but seeing they are in effect the same with the former, I pass them by; and shall come to the next thing thou dost think to catch me withal, and that is; because I say, that "God only is the Saviour, there is none besides him." Therefore sayest thou, how contrary is this to that in p. 24, where I say, How wickedly are they deluded, who own Christ no otherwise that as he was before the world began. Now this in no contradiction as thou wouldest have it; for though I say there is none but God our Saviour, yet I did also then in my book shew how he was our Saviour, namely, "in that he came into the world, being born of a virgin, made under the law, that he might redeem them that were under the law, by his obedience in that nature, by suffering in that nature, by his rising again in that nature, and by carrying that nature into heaven with him," as the scriptures at large declare; and therefore, though I say God is our Saviour, and none besides him; yet they that own him to be the Saviour no otherwise than as he was before the world began, are such as deny that he is come in the flesh, and so are of antichrist (1John 2) For before God could actually be a Saviour, he must partake of another nature than the divine, even the nature of man (Heb 2:14,15).

Again, thou sayest, it is a sander put upon the Quakers, to say, they slight the resurrection: Ans. What say you, do you believe the resurrection of the body after it is laid in the grave? Do you believe that the saints that have been this four or five thousand years in their graves shall rise, and also the wicked, each one with that very body wherein they acted in this world; some to everlasting life, and some to everlasting contempt? Answer plainly, and clear yourselves, but I know you dare not, for you deny these things.

But if you speak doubtfully, or covertly in answer there unto; I doubt not but God will help me to find you out, and lay open your folly; if I shall live till another cavil by you be put forth against the truth.

The next thing thou cavillest at is, that query raised from (Eph 4:10). and thou sayest I have not answered it. You should have answered it better, or else have confuted that answer I gave unto it, and then you had done something: But the great thing that troubles thee is, because I say, (further in my book) he that ascended from his disciples, was a very man, "Handle me and see; saith Christ, for a spirit hath not flesh and bones as ye see me have." Now let the adversary shew by the scripture (said I) that there is in them any place called heaven, which is able to contain a man of some four or five foot long (or a competent man of flesh and bones) for the space of fifteen or sixteen hundred years, but that above the clouds, which troubles thee so, that it makes thy tongue run thou canst not tell how; but know, that when the son of man shall come from heaven to judge the world in righteousness, that which thou callest foolishness now, thou wilt find a truth thereby to thy own wrong, if thou close not in with him, who said, "Handle me and see, for a spirit hath not flesh and bones as ye see me have" (Luke 24:39).

Another thing that thou art troubled at, is, in that I do reckon the Quakers to be of the deluding party; when alas, all men that have eyes to see; may easily discern, that you are of the generation, as will appear in part by your own expressions, both now, and also at other times. But that you may take off the brand from yourselves, you say, that the false prophets and antichrist, were in the apostle days, as though there should be no false prophets now, when the very time we live in doth manifestly declare, and hold forth, that there are many, who at this day seek to beguile unstable souls, of which sort you are not the least, though for ought I can learn as yet, you are the last, (that are come into the world) but that you may the better shift it form yourselves, you say, that in those days there was not a Quaker heard of; namely, in the days of John. Friend, thou hast rightly said, there was not a Quaker heard of indeed, though there were many Christians heard of then. By this you yourselves do confess, that you are a new upstart sect, which was not at other times in the world, though Christian saints have been always in the world. Friend, here like a man in the dark, in seeking to keep thyself out of one ditch, thou art fallen into another; instead of proving yourselves no false prophets, you prove yourselves no Christians, saying, There was not a Quaker heard of then. But if Quakers had been Christians, then they would have been heard of the glory of God, and his Christ.

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